Meet our guest, Zaid Kirdsey, a professional illustrator who's making a substantial mark with his unique artistic philosophies. Zaid shares his secrets on how he harmonizes his creativity with the stark realism of life, while also letting us in on his ambitions, including his aspiration to rank among the top artists of his generation.
We chat about individual journeys into the realm of digital art, including an inspiring conversation with a participant whose life has been profoundly impacted by this new art form. Moreover, we delve into an artist's journey into the NFT space, their initial experiences, and their strategies to thrive within this novel artistic frontier.
As we navigate this artistic odyssey, we also touch upon a potpourri of other subjects - from the tranquil joys of outdoor living to the trials of showcasing art on the internet. Hear about his method of finding inspiration in the most mundane objects, their collaboration with the brand RTFKT, and their personal strategies to combat procrastination. Hold on to your seats as we navigate the choppy waters of artistic egos, the impact of celebrity NFTs, and the subtle art of mindful art collecting. So, whether you're an artist, a collector, or simply someone with an appreciation for creativity, this episode has something for you.
Zaid links:
Website: https://www.ruffhousearts.com/
X (Twitter): https://twitter.com/Jruffhouse
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/zaidkirdsey/
SHILLR:
Website: https://www.shillr.xyz
Twitter: https://www.twitter.com/shillrxyz
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/shillrxyz
Youtube: https://www.youtube.com/@shillrxyz
Music by 800DB
Twitter: https://twitter.com/800dbmusic
Meet our guest, Zaid Kirdsey, a professional illustrator who's making a substantial mark with his unique artistic philosophies. Zaid shares his secrets on how he harmonizes his creativity with the stark realism of life, while also letting us in on his ambitions, including his aspiration to rank among the top artists of his generation.
We chat about individual journeys into the realm of digital art, including an inspiring conversation with a participant whose life has been profoundly impacted by this new art form. Moreover, we delve into an artist's journey into the NFT space, their initial experiences, and their strategies to thrive within this novel artistic frontier.
As we navigate this artistic odyssey, we also touch upon a potpourri of other subjects - from the tranquil joys of outdoor living to the trials of showcasing art on the internet. Hear about his method of finding inspiration in the most mundane objects, their collaboration with the brand RTFKT, and their personal strategies to combat procrastination. Hold on to your seats as we navigate the choppy waters of artistic egos, the impact of celebrity NFTs, and the subtle art of mindful art collecting. So, whether you're an artist, a collector, or simply someone with an appreciation for creativity, this episode has something for you.
Zaid links:
Website: https://www.ruffhousearts.com/
X (Twitter): https://twitter.com/Jruffhouse
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/zaidkirdsey/
SHILLR:
Website: https://www.shillr.xyz
Twitter: https://www.twitter.com/shillrxyz
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/shillrxyz
Youtube: https://www.youtube.com/@shillrxyz
Music by 800DB
Twitter: https://twitter.com/800dbmusic
GM, this is Boone and you're listening to Vaulted, a web 3 podcast series from the Shuler Archives. This episode was originally recorded on October 31st 2022 and features Zaid Kurtze. Zaid is a professional illustrator who has been creating art since 2014 and is currently represented by AOTM Gallery. In this episode, we discuss everything from his artistic philosophies, balancing ambition with realistic expectations, barriers to showcasing art online and much more. As always, this podcast is for entertainment purposes only and should not be relied upon for financial advice. Boone and guest may own NFTs discussed. Now it's time to grab some coffee and dive into this comfy conversation with Zaid. Gm. Zaid, how are you man?
Speaker 2:Good man, how are you Thanks?
Speaker 1:for having me. Good, I'm happy we got together to do this. Man, it's been fun to watch you in the space and vibe with you on some of the Twitter spaces. Yeah, it's good to be here. I think we're both in Texas same city, perhaps so I'm trying to spend a little bit more time outside. How about yourself?
Speaker 2:Yeah, it's funny you say that I have been kind of like I use my cat as an excuse now to go out more so I get to touch more grass. But I've been doing this grounding thing where you walk around on the outside without socks or anything. I don't know if it's true or not, but they say there is magnetic fields in the earth and it's supposed to match with your energy and whatnot. I don't know, but it feels good though, to be out there barefoot on the grass and just touching grass.
Speaker 1:It feels pretty good. I think that's all that really matters. Though, man, there is something to be said, and I've done some meditations where I've just solely walked around barefoot and just like there is something about it. I can't tell you the science behind it or the spiritual energy behind it, or whatever the case may be, but it feels good and it's probably a good way to start your day.
Speaker 2:Yeah, for sure. Plus, you know you get a little vitamin D from the sun when you're out there, and it's finally starting to cool down a little bit here, so it's easier to be outside.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I'll tell you, man, I've been having this like thought where I think it's Texas. I just don't go do shit during the summer, I just hibernate. Man, I sweat when it's like 75 degrees and so I'm sweating. I'm sweating, so I've been thinking of trying to like get like a like go buy a condo somewhere in the West Coast, like Airbnb, that shit, for like eight months, and like go live there during the summer and just like rent it out for the rest of the year. You know what I mean.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I know exactly what you mean. That's really been one of my goals, to be honest, because I do love over here where I live and I could definitely see this be like my forever home. But, like man, like during the summer, like I need to give me like a nice little like cabin somewhere in Colorado or something, yeah, somewhere where it's like 70s highs in the summer, bro, because I absolutely hate summers here in Texas and a lot of people in summers they, you know, start partying, go out, whatever. Like I'm like you, like I hibernate during summers and just work, work, work and then, once it starts getting cooler, that's when I, when I start having fun.
Speaker 1:Yeah, man, it's tough because I imagine you've like you've, you're a local here. Yeah, you've lived here your whole life.
Speaker 2:No, I've been here since 1998. Gotcha, I moved here from Mexico when I was in second grade, but I mean I yeah pretty much been here all my life.
Speaker 1:Yeah, so I mean you built your roots here, man, like it's hard, it's like it's hard to to to lift those you know there's. You probably built like some really strong connections with people here.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, for sure. I mean, even though I wasn't born here, I'm pretty much like my. My life is here. You're like, yeah, everything that I know is here, and so I like it. It's cool. Just, man, it's getting pretty bad with the traffic and all that stuff, but I don't know.
Speaker 1:So what happens with with. It's one of the most desirable cities to live in, man, like everyone from California coming here, and just you know it's a bro, I see Florida plates everywhere.
Speaker 2:Yo California plates, yeah, and that that's what scares me are the Florida plates, because Florida people are fucking crazy. They are man.
Speaker 1:They are the Florida man and yeah, like all the craziest shit in the world mostly happens in Florida, bro.
Speaker 2:Yeah, that's what I'm saying.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I didn't even until you said that, I even noticed that, man, you're absolutely right. Well, it should be. Should be spicy man. But, dude, this has been glad again, glad you're here, man. Let me let you give a brief introduction. Man, like for the people who don't know, you say who are you, what do you do?
Speaker 2:man. Man, I'm just a guy that likes to draw a lot and I pretty much draw every day of my life, if I can. And I'm really here just to improve and just be one of the fucking bear for of this generation. To be honest, that's one of my goals. Like I really believe that you are the architect of your destiny and I'm just here trying to.
Speaker 2:I've seen the blueprint from other artists and I've seen what other artists have done, so I'm kind of one of those people that, like, if they can do it, I can do as well. And yeah, man, I'm here for like the long run. I'm one of those artists that I'm gonna say I don't care about money, because you know it is important for my family and whatnot to help them out. But, man, like, to me, like I, all I really care about is making art in this life, to be honest, like everything else for the most part comes secondary. So I guess I guess you could say I'm a very passionate individual when it comes to art and it's a very precious thing to me.
Speaker 1:so it's easy to tell man. I mean, I've collected one of your physicals, you know, and that was like one of the. That was like where we first connected. It was the hell version. I can't forgive me, I can't remember the pronunciation of the exact name, but it was the.
Speaker 1:It's all in the tech, yeah, all in the tech. I got that beautifully framed, like I you know that was. That was like one of the ones I wanted to like, wanted to make sure I put a little extra TLC to you know and and put that where I could see it every day. Man, it's a, it's a fantastic piece. There's so much detail in it.
Speaker 2:Thank you, brother. That's actually the only one out of all my NFTs that I have that I got. Yeah, have up in my walls right now. Yeah, because I so. My first one, my first NFT I I took it out of the frame to use it for something else, so I had to roll that up and I don't have anything else. So when it comes to my my own art on my walls, that's like the only piece I have. No shit.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I just I'm I'm kind of like bad about having like my own stuff on the walls, just because I I kind of like, for starters, I don't have the space to have everything up that I want and second of all, it's like it kind of seems like at least to me like a little like egotistical to like have your own shit up like I don't know. I rather have other people's art up on the walls, but I don't know, that's just that's me right now. I think big part of it is I don't have the room. Yeah, so maybe if I had the room on the walls I would have more stuff up.
Speaker 1:That's actually what got me into the, into the space of like even collecting art in the first place is that I didn't or at least in the NFTs space I should preface that is that you know, I just don't have the physical space to put up art, you know, or that much art in my apartment. I live in like a little, you know one bedroom apartment and I just I did not want to have to like be forced to make decisions. I mean, I did. You know, it's all fucking tool, posters like there's nothing wrong with that.
Speaker 1:No, it's not man like four, four out of like. I think the seven things that are framed art, pieces of art that are framed in my wall art are tool or tool related tool, that's awesome.
Speaker 2:Well, let me ask you a question so, because I've heard that before a lot, the argument of like NFTs, like they don't take up space, I can take them wherever I want them, but it's like, can I like if you? If I ask you to be answered truthfully do you get the same joy from an NFT that that's just in your wallet, in your phone, compared to like something that's on your wall that you can actually like physically? Like, see, even if it's like a digital frame, like that counts too.
Speaker 1:Like, yeah, it's a good question and I, it's a good question. I haven't bought a digital frame yet. It's, but what? What I would answer to that question is that to me it means a lot, but for a different like, I feel like I don't. I can't compare the feelings because the outside of your piece, the art on my wall, I have no personal like, like super intimate connection with. I think that's the most important thing of like.
Speaker 1:The digital aspect of this is that, like every piece of art that I buy digitally, number one it just feels more permanent, if that makes sense, just because I know the record can't ever be deleted or altered or nothing. No mistake can be made once it's done, and I usually have a really strong connection with people I buy art from. You know, like on a personal level. So that's I. The feeling isn't the same. Like I love tools, tools, like my favorite band, the fucking world, but like you know, I've, I don't, I'm not, I haven't gotten to like vibe with them one on one or like get to know a part of their story. I like it's a very platonic relationship. You know what I mean, yeah, yeah. So I'd say like it means a lot for different reasons and I'd say that's what was most intriguing to me is that I didn't really fully understand that I wanted to do that until the space came along, until I could, you know it. Does that make sense?
Speaker 2:no, 100%. I think you're like the first person that's actually ever really explained like that, because the explanation I always hear, the basic explanation, is oh, they don't take up all the space and I can just take them with me whenever I want freely. So easy, but it's the ease of access to it, or whatever.
Speaker 2:Yeah, but, me coming from like a physical side. First, it's like you know, I I want to see the damn thing on my wall or be able to touch it, and that's it could be the same, it goes way, it goes the same way for like a digital frame right like I count that as like a physical too. Sure, so you know that's cool, but like, just for me to have it on my phone and like, yeah, and not like someone on my wall, there's something. It's kind of like I'm still more on the physical side when it comes to that aspect interesting, interesting.
Speaker 1:No, I and I like you, like, I like how you're exploring both realms, because there's a few artists that I follow in the space that like there's some people that like go all in to digital and some people that are like how I like straddle this really good line of like digital and physical, you know, and so I can appreciate that man, because I'll tell you like I would, I think it's, I think it's a lie, it's like, oh yeah, I can take it everywhere.
Speaker 1:Like that to me that that that's not a very strong argument.
Speaker 1:I think part of the other reasons that I'm most bullish on like what this can be, you know, like when, if you look at like how early I hate to like meme it on on air, but like how early we actually are when it comes to the, the, the things that we can do with this technology is still like, I mean, it's still in its infancy. You know, like in the digital frames are dope, they're, they're insane, they're, they're like they're getting a lot better. The technology is getting greater, but like I still feel that the use case isn't quite there yet. But I just look at the future of like being people being able to travel and put up digital galleries and have people go walk and kind of have that like immersive experience, especially when it comes to like AR and VR and like what that'll look like in like five to ten years. I think that's really where, you know, I get excited. I get excited for that as well, like, I think just the future of like what this could be.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I mean yeah, for sure. I mean there's you see, these crazy things in the space happening, or just that's one thing I really do enjoy about this whole thing. Like the whole space with 3D, it's just a the how easier it has become to be able to discover and connect with other amazing creatives. That's like my favorite part. Man and you know some people might listen, you know he's lying Like he's made some good money or whatever Like, yeah, bro, like I made some decent money and I was able to help my family out and whatnot. But like, bro, like really like. My favorite thing about this is that I'm now friends with, like certain artists that I used to look up to before all this you know what I'm saying. Like, and because of the space, I was able to connect with them, become friends with them, and I'm working with some of them now and that's like dude, I love that.
Speaker 1:Like, if I wish that could happen with every artist that I look up to or that I like Dude yeah, that gave me chills, man, that's fucking cool and I wanted to like hone in a little bit on that. Man. Like you talked about like coming into the space, like how did you like first discover this and like what was your like your entry point?
Speaker 2:I think, honestly, it was 2020, november, if I remember correctly. But the reason why I even found that because of them, you know. Just, you're on Twitter, you're scrolling and you start seeing these like art pieces being sold for crypto and you start looking into it and you're like, oh, they're selling for this much, like that's interesting. But like, like, what is this? Like, why are people getting paid like this? Like, who are these? And I think, if my memory serves me right, I think like one of the first people that I saw, or it might have been like somebody tweeting about farewell, and I think that's what really got me like curious and I was like, oh, let me check this out, Read into it. And then I came across Lupify's page and I just kind of went down the rabbit hole from there, because he was the one, or they were I don't know if he's a male or female, whatever, it's anonymous or it's anonymous, but they were the ones that really, like you know, were tweeting a bunch of information about this and like, obviously you, you could tell that there were some sort of important entity in this space because they had a lot of engagement, they knew, it seemed like they knew what they were talking about. And, yeah, I just started like not creeping on this page, was basically going through some of the stuff and wondering. I was like this is interesting. And I started following Super Rare after that kind of went on their page and just saw that you had applied. So so I did. And luckily, back then around that time they it wasn't as hyped up because it didn't take that long for me to get accepted. I think it took like two months, if that, maybe like a month and a half, and I my understanding now it's it's really, really hard to get in there. Just, I'm sure there's slam with applications and I got my grasp with them now, but you know, at the end of the day, they are providing some good opportunities for for artists, but I think they could be doing more. But that's a whole different conversation. But I do got to thank them for giving me the start in the space and but yeah, it was around like late 2020.
Speaker 2:And then when I got accepted, I I've already had a bunch of like works that I you know that I really liked but that I could have minted right away. But I was like I kind of thought about it and I was like, well, your whole, your whole thing has always been to take people on this journey with you. When you work on a piece, like you know, show them like the first sketch, first idea, and then from there you start building it and then show works in progress as you work through it. That's always been how I like to do it, just because I like to be able to bring people in with this journey with me, to to see how it all starts and to see the progress and whatnot, because I like, I would like to see that from certain things that I like, like from a video game, for example, I would like to see like the first, like what's the first, first, first thing that happens when you make a video game. Yeah, you know, I just like, I like to know how things work for things that I like or enjoy. So I just think it's a nice way to to get people involved or just invested in something and they can see it being built up from the ground up. So that was always been my, my, my blueprint. So I was like you know what? You have all these pieces, but they're old and I think it just makes perfect sense to do it entering this space so people can see what you're all about.
Speaker 2:And you know, I, I, I ended up doing like that. I, my first, and the crazy thing is I was already working on on faces before this. I just like didn't know what I was going to do with it. So it was kind of like a sketch of progress already and when I got accepted I was like, oh man, this piece is actually coming out really cool, like this is going to be it, this is going to be my Genesis. But yeah, I, I, I waited it out. I started, I did more networking as I worked on the piece I guess that's how these came across my page and some other like people. And yeah, man, it ended up working out and and and I waited till January to meet my first, my first P, my first entity, my, my Genesis.
Speaker 2:And, and I clearly remember I have a list of like key people that like made it happen. Like, besides, the super rare people like Alessio I don't know if you're familiar with him. He's like I think he's like a curator now or for them now. I don't know if he's still, but he's. He's basically like a badass, like a visual artist. I just got luck, I got lucky that he, he liked my work and and he retweeted it. And when he retweeted it is when my collector my suit, my collector, that the collector that became the collector of my Genesis piece saw it and and so that's that's how my art got into that first collector because of Alessio, who retweeted my work, because I clearly remember I was like he retweeted it and after that my shit started blowing up and I could tell, like I talked to I can't even say his name my collector, the first one I can't it's fast, fast act or something like that. Okay, just, you know people have like weird names, but but anyways, yeah, he was like man, yeah, he's the one that told me he's like Alessio. I saw it because Alessio retweeted it and I had to check you out and whatnot. And man ended up turning out to be a really good dude and he, just he loved my work so much and he, I had this thing where I was like, okay, so I had never sold something for that much, which at the time my Genesis sold for like 12.1 E, which equals like $15,000 or something like that, which pretty much kind of like prices like now, because I remember he was like at 1200 and something.
Speaker 2:Yep, when I first entered the space and or sold my first energy and you know, I was like, so like I was like dude, what the fuck? Like I've never like up to this point, like the most I've ever gotten for like a one at a one drawing physical was like $1,000 or $2,000 or something like that. So I was like whoa, like this is crazy. Like, and then you know, that whole idea was still fresh in my mind.
Speaker 2:We're like people are just buying like the digital, like I don't have to send them anything, like that's pretty weird, like that doesn't feel right, like I was like it's only right that like I framed this in a nice frame and ship it to this person because they fucking pay $15,000 for it. Like I wasn't even thinking. I wasn't even thinking of like the digital I hate that word I wasn't thinking about that. I wasn't thinking about like any of that shit, bro. I was thinking about like bro, it only makes sense for me to send him the fucking physical. And it makes even more sense to keep it a one at a one.
Speaker 2:And then, you know, if he's cool with it, I'll ask him, if he's cool, to let me do an alternate version of it and make it like 15 non NFT.
Speaker 2:So the NFT stays rare and you know, the other alternate version keep it very limited, like 12, 15 prints, which will also make it rare and it kind of be its own thing apart from the NFT.
Speaker 2:But it's still obviously tied to the NFT because it's the same image, just a different colorway and you know, kind of feeds both of the worlds the new world that I entered, the NFT space, and then my, my old world that I came from, while keeping the blueprint of staying limited and exclusive on both sides. So but I always told myself I would only do this alternate version of the NFT if the collector is cool with it, despite the fact that I still own the rights to everything and I don't need to ask them. It's just for me and my eyes, especially for people paying that much, it's like the right thing to do. It's like an old brainer, it's kind of like a common courtesy, you know. And then you know I just ended up working out with all four or five of my collectors that I have so far, or six, including Sobi, because they split that all the time.
Speaker 1:That piece is sick man. I fell in love with that that was one of my like the, the, the, like the space, like the space, neon, like aesthetic of. That was just man like Jeff's kiss dude, this shit's awesome.
Speaker 2:Thank you, man. And those pieces are actually harder to make because, see, like a style piece, like friends it's, it's there, is like a, there's a, everything is where it's supposed to be for a reason and characters are interacting. But it's like for all the tech, if you look at it, like I had to like make certain things look like. I couldn't fake it. Pretty much like with friends, I can fake some of it with shapes and whatnot, because you can make little characters out of shapes and whatnot and make things fit like that because everything's so together and there's so much going on. But with all the tech, it's like I was making an actual scene, like it wasn't just like random chaos into you know, like I had to find things to flow right and and you know, like, you know the thing, the alien, the bottom is like you know, walking through this I don't know meteor, and there's like a pool of something in there and smoke, toxic gas coming out of it, and like things growing out of plants, alien plants. So it's like a. It's like an actual like scene. You know what I'm saying.
Speaker 2:It's like you could tell what that like is with friends, like, yeah, you look at it and you're like oh yeah, it's a bunch of like cool dope shit together or whatever, but that's like an actual scene. So those are, those are a little harder, if I'm being truthful, because it's like especially for, like, the main, like ailing on the on the top. It's like, yeah, I drew this hand, the left hand, if you're looking at, if you the left hand, I drew that first right. So now I got to like actually think about what a right hand will look like, holding, you know, and a different, you know, I gotta think about the right hand. But, like, at this other angle, it's not just like a flat image, you know, so it's, it's kind of like it's hard in that sense.
Speaker 1:So I got to ask on a piece like that, where you have to set the stage and you got to, you got. It takes a little bit more thought like how do you like? Where does this, where does this inspiration come from? Like that piece like what? Like how did you, how did they even come to fruition?
Speaker 2:So this one if you've ever played the Metroid series in Nintendo, I always Metroid the series is. It has been my favorite Nintendo franchise or whatever, and I've always been like Samus is probably my favorite Nintendo character ever. So I like the whole alien thing and the space pirates that she has to fight is where where I drew like the inspiration for for that main creature and a little bit of alien too. But really like this piece was really inspired by like Metroid and, yeah, just like Metroid and a combination of alien, because HR Giger, the guy who who designed and created all the stuff for the alien movie, is like one of my favorite artists of all time and I, you know, I just kind of wanted to like not attribute to him in a sense, because it was more of a just me trying to like do something in that kind of style of like alien and and Metroid kind of together.
Speaker 1:Dude? Yeah, no, it's. I'm always super curious. I have a you know, and I ask that question and I because I'm I'm trying to understand a little bit better, because I have a friend. One of my best friends is a kid who, you know, just insanely, just insanely talented artist. He's not in this space yet, but every time he would just like explain his process to me, I would just like nod my head and acted like I understood, because the way you know, y'all's brain like works is just like, like it just doesn't compute to me. You know, when I watch him do something live or like watch like something in motion, it just I just kind of sit. I don't even know what questions to ask sometimes. It's just like how does your brain like come up with this and then translate that into reality? You know what I mean? It's just, it's always a really impressive.
Speaker 2:I think I For the longest time I couldn't answer that question and I think now I can. And I think once you start of Serving Everyday life, everyday object, it could be like a hat, a spoon, and just like Really observe it and like look at the shapes and lines, you start to like in In your mind, kind of trace it and be like, okay, if I was to draw it, like, okay, now I know what a spoon looks like, so next time I need to draw a spoon, like I remember. So it's kind of like that we're like you kind of close your eyes and you see a picture and you're like, okay, think about like these lines, how would they flow? And then you just start kind of like sketching it out. It's, it's weird, but a perfect example for me is like so I Don't know where I started being able to draw little cat creatures, real easy on friends. Like I don't know where. Like I just like one day I say I'm gonna draw a cat in here because I had my case and I was I'm gonna add a cat to it, and I was okay, cool, and I was like it was amazing how easily I was able to like flesh it out. I was like huh, interesting and and I kept doing more and more and I was like I Just, I was like it dawn on me, it's like this has to be like my subconscious, from me looking at my cat every day with intent, because I, you know, I'm look at her and it's more of like, oh man, she looks really cool, look at her code, and I'm really paying attention to her and like, looking at her, kirk, we quirky ways, and but I think by doing that, it's like my subconscious was able to pick up like Angles of legs when she's doing certain things, or and and that like just made it so much easier for me to able to like just draw like a cat From from just my thoughts, like with no references, no, nothing, and so it's, yeah, it's, it's weird. I guess that's just how it's happening for me and and I learned that a lot too from from the late Kim Jong-il G, who just passed away.
Speaker 2:Amazing artists, I think he's he's definitely my favorite freestyle artist of all time like that man Would just fucking draw on with ink and no sketch anything, just freestyle and and the things that he would come out come up with or fucking amazing and and he you know that that's where I got it from. Like he's like you, I. You just got to observe with intent, like you. Just you look at a shoe Every day, right, but you never like tell yourself Okay, if you were to draw this this way, you got a. That's how it looks like. So I think it's, you got to put it, you got to add, you got to add those observations to you, to your own context, in your own world. Um gotcha gotcha.
Speaker 1:No, no, it's a super. That's all I mean. So I guess the follow-up is that is like Is that how you just learned? Was like by just like watching other dope artists? Like was there any sort of school that you went to, or how did you, how did you learn all of this?
Speaker 2:I Don't know man I I.
Speaker 2:Would say I would say by just observing, because I've always like, like I felt like I've always been into the cool shit. Like growing up, like as a kid, I used to watch like Dragon Ball. I say say fucking, what was the other one that I used to watch? Those are the two mainly main ones that I remember like anime wise, but I thought that I thought they were just like the coolest thing and like I don't know man, I think, just like me Observing, like everything that I like, like cartoons, like I Think Everything that like, if you ask like that to other artists, I think we're just an accumulation of all of ourervations and experiences, like whether it's like a music you listen to, anime you watch, whatever, like your subconscious is.
Speaker 2:It's a tricky motherfucker and and it's always it's always observing, of observing and observing, and and, yeah, man, I think you, just when you ask somebody like, how do you come up with this man? I think it's just a Some of everything you've experienced and seen throughout your life. I.
Speaker 1:Love that man. I'm actually reading the, the autobiography or not? No, no, not a autobiography is the one that's like written by yourself, like by the person with the biography of DaVinci, and it's what? Like listening or like watching that book or reading that book. It's very interesting is that, you know, he's got such a mass for way of observing Everything and in combining like his observations with math and like using that to like create everything that he does, like I'm.
Speaker 1:I think over time I've started to like Get it a little bit more, if you will, where it's like, okay, cool, this is just literally quieting the mind and seeing what's around you and like noticing it with intent, like you were saying earlier, kind of like also what you're, like it also speaks to you know, you kind of like walking around the grass and like feeling the energy and like what you, what you observe, because I feel that there's so much More to life to observe when we actually just like shut up, like try to shut our own minds up, and just like think about how things actually feel, like when it's hot outside and you walk into the apartment like and what like when it's hot outside and walk into my apartment like Noticing the actual feeling on every part of my body, like the way that feels.
Speaker 1:You know what I mean and I know it just seems like a cool, like translation of that to like actual work that like makes people Like feel really good. I don't know, I don't know if that makes sense, but it's a bit big ramble.
Speaker 2:It definitely makes sense. Yeah, because another thing is like I see another question and then, if I'm being honest with you, it's a bad question. Interviewers Don't do it. It's a when they, when people ask, like, where do you get your inspiration from? It's like, bro, like I can literally it. That's like a. So, like a day-to-day kind of thing. You know, like cuz, you could just be Driving down the car and you have your Spotify on shuffle or whatever, and this brand new song comes on. And you know, you know when. That it happens to everybody. When you first hear that a new song, that you're like whoa, what is this? Like? Okay, this is dope. Like that feeling, like you know what I'm saying, you, you know that's, that's random and you don't know when that's gonna happen in life. So when, when people ask, like what inspires you? Like I don't know, like today could be fucking just me going outside and filling a nice breeze and that could inspire me, like it's, like it's another, it's it's the sum of everything.
Speaker 1:Again, when it comes to that question, in my opinion, 100%, man, you know, and something that I'm gonna take it. I'm gonna take it in another direction, man. So, like we, if we're following your timeline here of, like you know, coming into space and find this collective base like something that I've always wanted to know a little bit more about. Man, is that like you, you an artifact man? Like how did you, how did you start? Like, like, working with them, man, and what's that experience been like?
Speaker 2:I'm. I'm about to this point you because there's no, no, there's no glamour to it. Uh, it's just, literally just. I was on my Instagram one day and I was checking my DMs and I saw this guy named Zap deal Talking about like your work stuff, we should work sometime together. And I Was like. I went to his page and looked at it and I saw the 3d stuff they were doing and I was like, all right, this is pretty cool. They're making like 3d shoes. That's awesome. And I was like, yeah, cool man, let's do it for sure.
Speaker 2:I think, if I'm being honest, it was more of a like, not like blowing them up, but it was like all right, yeah, like sure, we'll work one day, like whatever. And you know, I don't, I can't, even, if I'm being honest, I don't remember that how much time passed till the next interaction. But he came in again. He was a hey man, we're working on this, this drip project. I don't know, I don't know if you've seen our among us character, that little red character they had before the drips and and, to be honest, I was like what is that? Like, that's kind of like. I don't know if I'm by with that, but you know. He was like yeah, man, bro, we're doing this, this and that and it's gonna be part of this and we have all the artists coming in and I was like you know what it would be a good way to like, I guess, get more eyes, get more web, three eyes on my work, type of deal.
Speaker 2:And yeah, and it just started like that and and it was good experience. I that's when I got introduced to Benito and Chris do zap deal and got on a phone call with them and it was, it was cool like that. I was like bro, look, I don't know 3d, like obviously you guys are doing this in 3d and they just like my work so much that they were like dude, don't worry about it, like just what's working out for you. Like you just got to come up with the design, the sketch, and I was like all right, cool. So that was like my first like introduction doing that, like kind of having to work on, like Having to work with the intent that this is gonna turn into a 3d thing. So I had it like approach it differently.
Speaker 1:Gotcha man. No, that that makes a lot. That makes a lot of sense and I can imagine it's an entirely different process. And, like, when it comes to, when it comes to like working with, I guess, I guess something that, like, I've also noticed is that, like you, you take on a lot, like you're doing friends, you still have your, your store online. You work with, you know you collab with artifact, like you know. Like, I guess is the simple question Is it like, how do, how does that all? Like has all come into play?
Speaker 2:I am a procrastinator, I Will. I will almost wait to like it's crunch time for me to start like really taking like the other project series. Because there's been times where, like I'm like working on a section on friends and I'm just like hood and I'm like, all right, tomorrow I'll start working on this. And then, like tomorrow comes and I'm like already coloring something, like alright, no, no, tomorrow, I'll do it for sure tomorrow. So I Think once the switch in my head actually like All right, you got to stop fucking around, like switch over to this project. Then it's like, it's like a switch man, I can't even explain it. It just happens like, yeah, I'm like alright, stop and start doing this now, like focus on this now. And it just happens and and it's actually kind of easy once I actually tell myself, all right, you got to do it, you got to do it. But, um, but I think at this point it's gotten easier to balance the, the me working with other people, because See the shit, you see me on the timeline working is like just just a surface.
Speaker 2:I'm actually working with two other projects. I have another one that I'm kind of like towing with. So if he wants me to do something with him. It's like and then I have another one out of one that I'm already working on that I'm gonna drop before friends, because like friends is it's another, it's yeah. And then I have my collab that I'm like brainstorming with you, go and dirty robot. So it's like I have a lot going on. But the cool thing about working with other artists is that they're assholes too and that they take their time with doing their thing. So so it's like I it's not, it's not a much pressure Working with them, you know, cuz it's like we're all kind of like bullshitting each other, like, oh, I gotta do, I'm doing this right now. So it's cool, don't worry about it, take your time. Type of vibe.
Speaker 1:It's a good vibe.
Speaker 2:It's a good vibe, it's nothing bad. The so it's like it. The balance is is this kind of like? I guess it's.
Speaker 2:It's easier now because I've given up on friends in the sense that, like there's no way I'm finishing this in a year, there's no way I'm finishing this in six months, type of deal, like I've already told that in my head, like you know, before I Was like, alright, you got to finish this by like next year, a certain month, to, like, you know, just do this and be able to afford this number them. But I was like, no, like you know what, I can't even think. I can't even put that burden on me anymore and Ever since I did that, I've been able to like it. It's open up the floodgate for for me to like really, really like, go all in on this piece, because I have I don't have the pressure anymore on myself of like hurrying to finish this, and it was never a pressure of like, hurry up, finish this. But it's like now it's like you know what this thing is becoming like its own living organism and it's like this is gonna be pride, like the most important piece you make, and for a long time.
Speaker 2:So you know why? Don't, don't do it to the service, just take your time with it, like you have been, and and go all out Pretty much. And that mindset has helped a lot To be able to work on these other things, to be able to take off a week and do like arm cannon concept for some so-and-so, or Go and do my side thing with Korea and work on these designs and it and and. At the same time, it helps and it keeps me fresh on friends because it switches my creativity to something completely else that once I come back to friends, it's fresh and like I have all these ideas and I'm excited to like keep working on that again because I'll be honest with you, working on a piece like that it as much as I love art and I live and breathe it, it gets.
Speaker 2:It gets fucking frustrating sometimes because sometimes, like it's not all fun and games. Sometimes I'm looking at this and like like like I'm I gotta do all this and like I still plan on adding all this shit here and like this is just gonna add like 10 hours to this and and Me saying that sounds bad. But at the same time, that's when I know I have something good. When it starts to frustrate me, like that, I'm like that you have something good, because that I know that if it's something that I need to take my time like that with it and it's gonna take that time, it's a good thing, it's gonna, it's it's me going the extra mile.
Speaker 2:So it's a weird fucking concept, man. I know it's like being frustrated, thinking that's good. But it's like, yes, I get frustrated because I'm adding all these sketches. And the frustration kicks in when I'm like, damn, I'm gonna have to ink all this, like that's the hardest part of all this, the inking, and then I'm gonna have to color all this after that too. So it's like then, my god, frustrating because I'm adding all this time, but it's like fresh, it's a good. Frustrating because it's like dope, shit that I'm adding to it.
Speaker 1:So I Resonated with that and I I live by that myself, but I've never heard someone actually like Spell it out like that. It means it like it's part of it's like a good awareness, like you know that you actually have something special here.
Speaker 2:It's kind of one of those things what's that saying? Like good things, worthwhile things are hard, take time or whatever. That's Like that's how I know. It's like it's like if I wasn't being frustrated or like Not getting mad, but I'm like Kind of complain to myself a little bit about like all the work that I'm gonna be adding. Then I'm not doing enough in the first place.
Speaker 1:I feel that, dude, I feel that when it comes to friends, like when it kind of like, if you could envision like the, the final part, like where do you, I guess, what do you? Where do you see that sitting? You know, when it comes like sit, you know when it's finished and someone collects it like where, where do you like, when you like Kind of like, realize that, that that end goal, you know like, where? Where is it Like? Is it like in a museum? Is it like on this like super dope, like canvas or not? Maybe not campus, like a super dope print? Like where? Where is this? And have you thought, I guess, have you thought about that?
Speaker 2:I mean jokingly I have, like, you know, I want to get this much for it. Or like blah, blah, blah, like, but in no seriousness, like it's something that, like, I wanted to end up. Obviously I wanted to end somewhere in good hands. You know a good collector and I hopefully that collector takes the time to get it into a museum or, you know, I don't know something along those lines. But as far as, like the final thing, it's hard for me to envision something done that I don't even know what I'll be adding to. Still, because so far, what I've shared about friends, like the canvas that you guys see, like my latest update on it, you see this canvas, right, it's, in a sense, full of a bunch of stuff and there's no more. Like you can still ask. I'm still going to ask a lot of things within the piece, but the canvas is set right, there's this canvas and you can't go outside of that canvas. What people don't know I, only only two people know this what I'm showing you right now, I'm still showing you, like if you were to cut that piece into thirds, that canvas, like thirds from vertical, horizontal thirds, if you take. So take, friends, what you see now I don't know if you're looking at it. If you, if you go, look at friends, divide it into thirds horizontally. There's a whole third that I haven't even shown you all. That's like not even part of the canvas right now. It's a third that I'll be adding to that canvas and see, people don't know that and I guess whoever listens to this will know now, but I plan on doing something pretty pretty. Not, it's not innovative at all, but it's.
Speaker 2:This piece is. It's called friends, right, and it's. There's a lot of people that are going to want to print. But if you remember back to my old formula that I said that it's all up to the collector If I make an alternate version of the, you know what? If that collector say say, he fucking buys my piece for like I don't know to say for the sake of just being funny, and want to like 2 million. And if that was to happen and he was like I don't want you making prints, I would definitely respect that Like.
Speaker 2:This person just came with $2 million Like. But at the same time I'm going to feel bad because it's like this piece is called friends. There's a bunch of my friends in there. There's a bunch of people that want to print. So I have a plan to be able to like bypass that old blueprint but still stay to the blueprint. I can't really talk much how to anymore because I don't want to ruin the surprise. But that extra third is going to be very important to making this whole work and my plan is that by the end of it the collector is going to be very happy and hopefully a lot of other people are going to be happy too.
Speaker 1:I like that man and I got to ask this if you can share or not. Is the third on the you said horizontal, like split into thirds, horizontally, correct? Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, it's on the. Is on the top or the bottom?
Speaker 2:It's going to be a it's, it's part of the top because, yeah, if you look at the top, if you look at the whatever lines are set right now at the top, if you pay attention, I purposely don't have, like, any characters or anything like going outside of that canvas, like it's pretty easy to like for me to incorporate that other third without disrupting what's already on there.
Speaker 1:Gotcha Okay. Yeah, I actually had to look at it on my phone because I can't really zoom like I can zoom in on the computer, but it's oddly enough like this is actually a better.
Speaker 2:Yeah, man, it's I that's.
Speaker 2:Another thing to this is a frustration with this is like it's like people are never going to be able to see like the true quality of the details the really small details are in there because this is unfortunately, the social media platforms just aren't built to be able to showcase something like that.
Speaker 2:So it's that's kind of like a bummer for me, like because the only way people would really be able to appreciate this is if I am able to make prints of it and know you can see for yourself in person. Or if you're like happened to catch me in person and I have my iPad, that probably be like the best way to actually experience this piece. But that's, it's a bummer, but I don't know. I guess we'll figure something I got to figure out some hate some way to display this once it's all done and like a really good quality online. So I'm thinking I'm going to, I'm thinking I'm going to make like my own website for this and my own contract and it's going to be badass, because I think this is this piece is too important for me to like put it in the hands of another platform like super rare ever platform, really 100% I agree with you.
Speaker 2:It's. You know, I kind of kind of did kind of get on their ass the other day, but it's like at the end of the day, they did give me a chance. But I just I'm a person that keeps it very real and I just don't see why I would have to give them 15% of the most important piece of my life thus far, when, when I don't really see any benefits of being in their platform, when I'm not minting anything, because at the end of the day, you know they're a business and they're going to tweet out their big sales, and I just wish they would support people in their using their platform when they're not making big sales. You know, like just retweeting some of their work, like to, because it's not necessarily about the retreat Retweet from them is more important than I say no offense to you Like that their retreat to an artist would be more important than a retreat from like you, because they have.
Speaker 2:They have that pool of collectors. You know what I'm saying. It's not even a numbers game like, oh I want more retweets because I want a bigger number. Like no, like cool, you retweeted SR super rare and it only gets like five retweets out of your retreat. But what's important is that collectors follow that page and you get the eyes more and collectors. So that's kind of my only like thing with that. It's like I just wish they would do more stuff like that. And it's, it's free and it's just one click. But you know, you see, you see them tweeting out their the bot cell faster than anything. Yeah yeah.
Speaker 1:And then that one tweet where they were like did you see that tweet where it was? This dude was standing outside the gallery with a, with a sign that said like. Please accept my like.
Speaker 2:Yeah yeah, that was kind of a slap in the face to two artists that have been trying to get in.
Speaker 2:The other thing that kind of bugs me about them is the how, when someone famous wants to get in, like they'll just put them in right away and like you know, meanwhile there's other, better, better art like Jim Carrey is a nice guy, but, man, his art is not up to par with some of these other people that have been waiting fucking months. You know, let's just call it what it is. Like you, you put them on your platform out of way for the cloud, for the fucking blah, blah, blah. Like if Jim Carrey wasn't Jim Carrey, like those pieces would not be selling, for whatever month they sold for us.
Speaker 2:That's his facts. But, yeah, but, but, but, but. But at the end of the day, this man, I can't be mad at him because he built a name for himself through all these years and in his, in his own craft, craft, with his in within his own right, and he's just wanted to experiment his art in another medium, which became paintings, and I'm not mad at him for that. It's more on the gripe, is more with the platform, you know.
Speaker 1:I feel that and I had this, I had a similar talk with Christopher Shin. He's a, he's a, he's a photographer based on the Pacific Northwest, and you know we're it was. It may not be the exact, it's a parallel where it's like, you know, there's a lot of web two artists or like people that have built a name for themselves and many other ways, that are coming in to the Web three space and experiencing like instant success because of their name or what they've done, while a lot of people that have been in here or that are more native to the Web three space have kind of like, have just like, been pushed, pushed aside or like it's like it's they haven't gotten their flowers yet when they've been, you know, put in the work here, not only in their art, but to like, push this space forward, to be perfectly real with you. You know, there's a lot of artists that like, like, like, do a lot more, a lot more for the space, and a lot of other people realize but it's this conflict that he was talking about, where it's like, you know, but also if they, if some of those artists back in the day hadn't done what they had done, this, you know, they contributed to what this like the, the almost like the prequel to this space.
Speaker 1:You know what I mean. So it's hard to. He's like it's hard, it's like I see it both ways. You know people here should be rewarded for like the work that they put into help for this space. But it's also people coming in that help build the previous space that have now come in here. You know it's like how should that be distributed? You know what I mean.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and that's, that's fair. My only gripe is like when people say, oh, this is good for the space is going to onboard people, but it's like we never really see that. We never see it in a quantitative like. I guess I just want to see like a chart or something oh, jim Carrey did this, all right, how many people did he like on board? How many people because of him, like join, have a wallet now, exactly.
Speaker 2:Like it's easy to say, oh yeah, serena Williams put a clone as her PFP, this is great for us. There's going to be like I think she changed the profile pic the next day Like that did nothing for a fucking artifact, in my opinion. I know none of my friends were like oh, serena Williams, like has a thing, what is that? I know one came asking you about that Like. So when I think that's like them, I think it's a slap in the face when you use that excuse like oh well, they're, it's great for the space because they're going to onboard, you collect blah, blah, blah. Like okay, but like there's never the worst, I need the proof. Like I want to see it. Like you can't just say that all this on chain data we have.
Speaker 1:We have all this thing that we can see publicly like no one's you know. That's. That's the. I agree with you because, like I'll tell you, when it brings up a good point, like when 100 thieves dabbled into NFTs, when their, when their team won worlds in League of Legends, oh yeah and then let everybody mentor, something like that.
Speaker 1:Yeah, dude, that was a huge moment because, like number one, you know, ethan switched to like proof of stake, so it was like still, you know, polygon was like the way to go. But that that led to like I can't remember how many people created a wallet to like meant that NFT and like bro, historically you've probably seen this like the gaming community hates NFTs, right Like so, to see that many people from the gaming community like trust 100 thieves that they were doing the right thing and to create and allowed like the creation of like like almost close like I think it was like close to like 100,000 new wallets were created after that event, like just to meant that specific NFT and that was like their first experience. I mean, that's dope. It's cool to see stats like that.
Speaker 2:Yeah for sure. Yeah, and that's like you know there's, there's the proof, I don't know. I just to me, that excuse or whatever is just not good enough. Like other onboarding people like you got to like do something else, but I don't know, and it's like you said. It is like because, like something, just just to keep using Jim Carrey's an example, like, yeah, man, that man put in, that man put in his work. He created a couple of amazing movies. He deserves it.
Speaker 2:Right, like I'm not mad at him at all for trying this to express himself in a new medium. Is this I wish? Maybe he would like acknowledge more, like I guess it's just like a public statement. Like that would be good from him. Like I'm trying to like learn. I'm here to like learn and stay and grow and not extract from the, from the space, and not just take, take. You know what I'm saying. Like I don't know, I don't keep up with the man like that. So I don't know, maybe he has done something now for the space, but as far as I know, he's just sold some pieces on here and that's it Like.
Speaker 1:So I believe he actually bought a piece from Ryan Cootman's on on Super, so you know he has. Like I feel what you're saying, like I think that one of the like, one of my favorite parts of this space is that you don't have to like be the superficial person that you were before you came in here Now and I'm not saying I'm curious, superficial, but it's more of like the having so many guards up is more what I really mean you know, it's like yo, you can be a human, here you can, you can have some like you can like.
Speaker 1:Let like one layer of the like, the guard down you know what I mean and still be okay, and people will like people here. It's what they don't realize is like because in the I understand why people do it, because in the previous version of the internet you were incentivized to put up as many walls as you could because it was like there was no incentive alignment, you know, when it comes to growing on social media, like. But here it's like with the introduction of some new like incentive models and some new technology that we have, like people with a trustless technology, people can actually fucking trust each other a little bit more. But I feel what you say of like having a statement would have been like nice to to have or like because Anthony Hopkins came in I'm not sure if you saw that and he kind of like made like a public statement about what he's doing.
Speaker 2:I did see that.
Speaker 1:I saw that I liked it yeah yeah, dude, it's been really cool experience of someone big coming into the space and it's felt the most real. Jim Carrey was the first, you know, but like again, he and he still has, he's bought, you know, other people's work, put some art out, but like having that statement I think is so valuable, like for people trying to come in here, they got to recognize that like there is a great amount of distrust. I don't care how reputable you are or how big your name is, you know there's always going to be a level of distrust when someone big tries to come into a space that's been built natively by a bunch of, you know, anonymous people on the internet.
Speaker 2:I think it just goes back to what you said earlier about just being aware, right, Like, obviously he was aware enough to make a statement like that, which was appreciated. So, yeah, it just comes down to that Like because, because, definitely like, if I was a big celebrity coming into this new space, I personally would think, like people would think that I'm just trying to extract money. So you know, you have to come in correct 100%, I think.
Speaker 1:I think we've seen some really cool examples, though. Is that when people have tried to come in with more malicious intent to extract? I can't. I think Chris Brown tried to like launch an NFT project. Oh yeah, I think you like 700 out of 10,000 or something like that. It was cool to see that, like yo, we built this and we actually reject you. You know what I mean.
Speaker 2:Like your status in your cloud doesn't always mean everything. That actually felt like a win and it felt nice because you could tell you could just tell he was doing it for the money man. Like there's no, you know there's no, he hadn't been around in the space, like it was just another cash grab that has managed to probably be like, hey, do this, it's everybody's doing it. Like it'll be easy.
Speaker 1:Yeah, it's an interesting topic, man. I mean it's I don't know. But when it comes to those platforms, like I've seen I know Super Rare takes a lot of flack and like going back to like that initial conversation about you know the platform, and like retweeting artist work, like I think, because going back to the original conversation of how you, how your first NFT got collected on Super Rare was by one retweet, you know what I mean. So like I'd like to like I just wanted to like circle back and amplify that because it's it doesn't, it's so true, it's it's so effortless. I mean it takes like 0.06942 seconds to even do that. You know what I mean. Um to like potentially get Actual like life-changing event. It's just why not?
Speaker 2:like, if I think, if it's because you don't want to mess up your time, feed On your own thing and make it look bad, that's kind of like so corny, I think, to another. If we're being honest, I think a lot of artists as artists I'll speak for myself, to include myself in this we kind of, in a way, have to Be a little bit ecotistical, just, you know, because ego hated to love it. The ego keeps you alive, right, eagle, is part of your survival mechanism and I think, at least from the web to space, I saw this a lot. I saw more jealousy between artists but not wanting, like, retweet other people's work because you probably thought they were gonna take away eyes from yours or you. Maybe somebody really did enjoy your work a lot, but they won't retweet it because they think that you're already. You're already good enough, so you don't need that between because they have less followers in you.
Speaker 2:I don't know just a bunch of a mixture of a bunch of different emotions in one of, but I think mostly the number one, one number one, would be in security, and I always tell people it's like I grow if you like, I think, if you're, if you're an artist and this may sound bad, but like this is to each his own definition. But if you're like a real artist, like you should be hype, you should be happy, you should be inspired by when you see a dope piece of art like, not just on the, anywhere, anywhere, but if you see one on, like your feet, like if you're really about the art and if you're really like, if art makes you happy, and why would you not Spread that to more eyes? You know it's, it's not gonna take away from your work, it's not gonna make your work any less better, any less good or more better. If you don't, if anything, it's gonna show people you have good taste. Because, yeah, you know, usually if you were to eat something dope, people gonna be like oh that's dope, like that's cool, like okay, and just subconsciously they'll start associating dope shit with you.
Speaker 2:But I don't know, man, it's just like, I think, and it's good for business too. Right, because you start building the connections with other peers and then They'll start helping you out, and why not? But I say all this to say that it all of this is it has to happen Organically. You can't like force people to do this, but it is appreciated once, like the vibe clicks and, like you know, you start helping each other out and I think, like I said, it goes back back to what I said earlier, like, are we tweet from an artist? We'll be more important than a retreat from someone that's not an artist, because, as an artist, you already have a pool of people that follow you because you, they like art, because they like your art. So, as an artist, you were doing other art. Is this? You know it's gonna be better, it's just gonna help everybody. I don't know, that's just my fucking utopia that I had to have in my head, that I would say, but it would be like, but Not everybody's like that, unfortunately.
Speaker 1:So it brings on the topic of like you know, artists have the best. If we are in here for the art, like it, artists have the best taste. Like, if I hadn't had a bunch of dope artists on and followed a bunch of dope artists and like, watch a bunch of their like, saw a bunch of the work that they shared whether they shared it on Twitter or shared it over like a phone call you know I wouldn't have had the in. You know the insane amount of guests on my podcast and the quality of guests that I've had on my podcast if it wasn't for that, you know. So I think it goes back to you know, for if we're like really looking at who this space is empowering and who really holds a lot of the power, I mean like it is the artist, you know. Like it because artists have the best taste in other art and you're gonna find other great art from other artists. And that's that's actually how I found Samantha Kavett in summer and summer Wagner it's like I'm on the show is because Joey like said yo, you need to like, get these, like, get these people on like they're fucking really good and shared their work. I'm like you're absolutely right. And then, like a month later, they both came on. So I think it just goes to to just to like amplify that, like you know, even though collectors have money, collectors are like important for the art space. I just think it's really important to to also like amplify the fact that, like you know, the best tastes come from people who have to create really good work. You know, it's just, it's just something that I thought about.
Speaker 1:And to to your other point, though I think it's just more of like what we were talking about offline. Maybe it was like right at the beginning or offline, I can't remember, but like I think that confidence around, like sharing other people's work is like has like a great deal. There's probably like a big correlation with like how much you know yourself and how much you know what you want, like how you know it, like how you know what you want. I don't even know if that makes sense, but like you know what you want, so you don't have a problem like sharing other people's work or like having that like confidence. No, like your shit's good or like your shit's on its way, whatever the case may be, that that's like those two, that those things came up from that ramble that you just said. I think those are really good one.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I mean I, I Get I personally get hype and super inspired when I see another artist. There's some dope work you know, like, and and I'm very like, I, I'm, I have no problem saying or thinking or saying it, or even tweeting it out loud like man, this aren't like, in my opinion, is better than mine. Like this, inspire me, like, if anything, like when I see something like that, bro, instead of like being jealous or like what it inspires me, I'm like, bro, that's fucking dope as fuck. Like I gotta go draw now. Like you know what I'm saying.
Speaker 2:Like it's, it does the opposite of what I think it does to a lot of people, unfortunately and that may be, and that may depend to on where people are in their careers, because it's gonna be harder for an up-and-coming artist, right, like seeing all these people get all these Engagements or sales and you're coming up, but that's that's what it's called, to come up like you're just starting you, you know what I'm saying. Some people do get lucky and and and right away. Like you know, fucking hit it, but for the most part, that's not how it happens for everybody. It's not how it happened for me. I, you gotta it's a come-up and you gotta grind and I just you know, instead of thinking that you are Gonna get out shined by these people, if you help spread their work, it's. I know it's hard to believe it, but it's actually under the opposite, it's gonna help. It's gonna help you out a lot.
Speaker 1:What's one of the, it's one of the ways we get, like you know, nfts and introduced a way to to signal support, you know, when it comes to like owning a token from an artist, but like that's, that's been the most simple way to show, I guess, a little bit of humaneness. You know, before this space became even available, is like you Like you know, like you are human, you do have good taste. Like you have taste, like there are things that you like and it's a signal, it's all a signal of what you like. And I think the most important thing for me here is that again, you touched on some good points about like number one, where people aren't in their career, but also like maybe there's some like you know, really personal shit that's happening in the moment. You know that's affecting the mood, because there's two sides to the ego. Like the ego is this necessary thing and it shows a lot of it to me. It shows a lot of my areas of growth, but it also it's a, it's a survival mechanism too at the end of the day, and it can be, it can be bruised over certain life experiences where, you know, people may not be in the best space, but we actually had a space yesterday with Fungi and Bernardo about this, for it's like kind of like people sharing their L's, like sharing like the headspace that people are in, because, like, sometimes this shit happens, you know, but it's, it's an important thing to.
Speaker 1:I think that the central, I think the through line here is like reading the room and self awareness of like where people are at in their journeys and like where you're at specifically and what it is that you actually want. So it's a very natural thing, I think, to feel when it comes to that. But I think it's more of the like hey, like do I have the awareness to realize that, like I'm in this, like funk, like this isn't, this isn't, this is only a temporary thing, or you know, or do I not? And you know, I think that just comes with time and experience. You know what I mean.
Speaker 2:Yeah, for sure, it's just, you know it's. It comes out again to like awareness. You just you know you can either be aware and and certain things like that make you feel bad, and then you, as certain sense, you're you're choosing to feel that way. Right, you're either choosing to feel some type of way or you can be inspired. So I think it's a choice, but you got to be aware of the choice. You got to be aware that you have the choice and, yeah, that's in a sense, putting some of the ego away and and realizing that you know it's better to realize that you can learn a lot from other people that are better than you than just be mad or upset or whatever.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, I mean, it doesn't also help say that we have we have this like insane financial element attached to it, with markets that are, like we've democratized, essentially, you know, financial tools, and now we have a speculative currency that you know it's in the shitter right now and everyone's bags are down, so that also doesn't help, you know. So that's a fun, a fun little layer when it comes to, when it comes to the space.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and also I got to get Samantha shout out. She was. She was the first artist that, a photographer artist that I collected an empty from. So she was my first NFC ever. No way, yeah, she's the first NFC I've ever collected. So, yeah, man, I love her work. I love what she's doing right now, making her photos look like paintings. It's pretty interesting. I know I bought her stuff because I knew she's going to be big and and she's getting there. Man, she's a.
Speaker 2:I remember at first when I knew about her, like not a lot of these bigger influencers knew her like fun G or D's and and now I see her in the mix and the combo, her being retweeted by them, shared by her, and I'm like man, like I.
Speaker 2:I I'm like I knew it, like I knew this was going to happen, like that's. You know, she was good vibes from the beginning. So I was like you know, and the subject matter that she was shooting a lot at the time was the moon, which the moon to me, is like one of my favorite things ever. So I just kind of like I was like I kind of was like studying her a little bit, saw the vibe, the photography was amazing and I was like you know what she's? She's even asking that much for this, like it's. I don't even think she was at, I don't even think she set a price. I think I just threw in a bid and I nobody else bid it against me and I ended up winning it. So I was really happy about that and I think I collected. I ended up collecting another one out of one from her, not too long ago.
Speaker 1:Yeah, the Japanese inspired, photos, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2:And so I have two of hers now and I'm ready to. I'm just waiting to cash out on there when she, when she becomes super big later down the road. No, I'm not Dude. Honestly, all this stuff I've ever bought from artists like I don't even I'm has never even crossed my mind to like I bought this to like slip, Like like I'm, I'm keeping all that Like you know it's, it's. It's.
Speaker 2:Obviously if somebody comes and offers you fucking millions and yeah, like, why not? But it's like, but I'm not gonna. I'm not looking for like quick, like $10,000 slip or even $100,000 slip on shit, Like it's, like whatever. Like I bought this because I really enjoyed it and I support the artist. But you know, if it was something like that with her, I'd be like, hey, I got an offer for like $100,000 and I know you get royalties. Like is that something you would want me to do so you get this royalty money? Or like it's not. Like I won't sell it if you, that's cool with you. Like I will.
Speaker 2:Like I'm that type of person like I'm the type of person that that wants to get rich of my own, of my own hand. That's why this whole like NFT flipping to me it's like it's cool, but I've never even really like slipped an NFT, bro, Now that I think about it, I've never sold anything for like profit, other than like one or two clones at the beginning, just to make my money back that I invested. But as me, as me like actively, like oh, I bought this to like flip and blah, blah, blah. Like never, never, done that.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I'm glad you brought that up, man, because, like I've never been I've never been a flipper myself of anything, you know, and I've I've made one. I've like the trades I have made like they've been very minimal, but, like there's been always this been this like desire to like make it like like to get that just insane level of of opportunity and growth and money, like from something that I do myself you know what I mean, not from something like in, especially like in this new ecosystem like I can't tell you how much I hate converting US dollars to Ethereum. So it's like it's been like one of my main like that feeling has been one of my main drivers like understand how to like actually make money natively in in ETH, because it just feels a lot better and it feels really cool to be able to do that, you know. So I can really empathize with that. It's like I made one good flip, though, you know, where I was able to knock down like half my debt and that was like a huge. That was like a huge moment for me, because I had just deep conviction in that project and it just it paid off. Now I made some life changing money from that.
Speaker 1:So I feel you, dude, like it's it's, it's, it's attractive, you know, and I understand that it also the flipping brings a lot of money. The flipping brings a lot of like liquidity into the ecosystem for art. I mean, there's a lot of good people that you know, I these and fungier like super clear and like like that's a lot of the reason why they flip PFS. They, you know, it's obviously to make money but to put us, you know, put a good chunk of that back into art scene. Yeah, and they do. Yeah, you know what.
Speaker 2:I mean, yeah, they're. That's why I respect them so much, because they're. They're about the shit they talk about, bro. Like you know it's. They're not just saying things to make themselves look good on the timeline, like they're actually about it.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, man, 100% do well, they won't start wrapping things up. There was a question I had in the beginning. I think I'll ask, ask you this in the end is if you could shoot, if you could make or if you could define your own genre of art, what would it be?
Speaker 2:Um, genre of own art. Um, I don't even know. There's other genres now I'm just saying, uh, I don't know. Man, I think the best way I could describe my art, and I would say my art as a whole, I'll use like the style of use, like on faces or friends, because I think that's really like my style. Um, I think if I was to describe or put a genre to that, it would be like organized confusion is what I would call it. Uh, just because it, if you just look at it from far, it looks like a bunch of random shit put together, but once you start looking at it closely, like you can actually see that a bunch of these characters are actually interacting with each other in some shape or some form. Um, and I think that's that's. It's just like organized. It looks like confusion from far, but it's it's somewhat organized in the front, if that makes sense.
Speaker 1:I like it. Now it's exactly what I was going for. Um, that's exactly what I was going for, man. No, I appreciate that. Um, it's been. It's been a treatment. Um, last, I want to give you a big plug, like where can people find you? Where do you want people to go discover your work?
Speaker 2:Uh, just meant socials Twitter, my, say it curtsy. You just Google me, I think. I think everything comes up. I mean, it's not like a fucking common name, the last name, so, but uh, so you'll be able to find. But man, just Instagram and say curtsy, twitter's J Ralph house, you can find me there. Word, I'm not, I'm not really. I'm really bad at plugging myself, man. I mean, it's like if you see me on Twitter or whatever, say hi, it's about it Word, man, I'm here, I'm here to.
Speaker 1:I'm here to at least play a part, to help you get out of your comfort zone a little bit.
Speaker 2:It's not even a comfort thing. It's like and I'm I'm not saying this in a bad way at all Like it's. It's like I just like don't care about that stuff. You know what I'm saying. It's like it's like whatever. Like you find me, you find me. It's like I don't really got nothing going on that you really need to know about right now, other than other than just me working on my friends pieces of stuff. But you'll, you'll definitely hear about that once, once it's closer to being done.
Speaker 1:I think the whole internet will, man, that's that's going to be spread far and wide. But again, man, thanks so much for coming on. Glad we, glad we could like make this.
Speaker 2:Yeah, man, thanks for having me and again apologies for for not being able to make it last time, but I had a lot of fun, man. It was. It was real chill and thanks for having me once again Appreciate it.
Speaker 1:Thank you for listening to the Schiller Vaulted podcast. We hope you enjoyed the conversation. As we close out today's episode, don't forget to subscribe to our podcast on your favorite audio platform and leave a five star review to ensure you never miss an episode and to help others discover the vaulted podcast as well. To stay updated on upcoming episodes, as well as our weekly Twitter space schedule, be sure to follow us on X, formerly known as Twitter, at Schiller XYZ. Once again, thank you for tuning in and remember if you're looking for it art is everywhere and it's up to us to appreciate and explore the emotions it brings to our lives. Until next time, this is Boone signing off.